XProfan

- Page 3 -

RGH

Frank Abbing

Hi,
And then go in almost all Sourcecodes still teh folks Klammeraffen to whom functions uses. must the really yet his? The latest Version, with the The Klammeraffen duty were, was of my Erachtens to Profan 4.5 or 5.0. now are we with 9...

naturally can since Version 4.1 The Klammerraffen omit, must But not. These in manuals and Help the Übersichtlichkeit halber beizubehalten, was my decision. That Stefan this of my convention follows, is aale. naturally is it Geschmacksache, whether one The Klammeraffen übersichtlicher finds or not. These Discussion there were in a previous Forum already once and there tendierte a majority to that Klammeraffen. eshalb kept I tappt im dunkeln in manuals and Help.
what Error in the Help concerns: simply a Mail on me what about me will be tappt im dunkeln collect and with the next Version respect.

Frank Abbing

i want really not your work on Help verunglimpfen, and naturally is you one Written-by-Vermerk in the Help self-evident permits. Übel aufgestossen is me but the mehrsekündige Spashscreen from Help Version 8. the had not his must. and the had Roland not to permit can.

of my Wissens having The XProfan-Help never a Splashscreen. (in the serious: i'm not even famous, How one in a HLP-File a Splashscreen install could.) are You sure, that the from you looked Splashscreen in the XProfan-Help was???

Frank Abbing

Roland: what I meant, was one Verzeichniss all on the Profan-CD vorhandenen Tools and Utilities. the ought to still quick to create his. where still The Order alike is - Why not alphabethisch?

here would I say, that so a list not The Help heard. The list heard sooner into Readme-File the XProfan-CD. The could in this Hinsicht something detail his, Perhaps even a Own Helpfile. i'll above cogitate. otherwise finds Yes eachone XProfan - so hope I - over The offizielle XProfan-Page too any others pages. straight The hiesige XProfan-Community is Yes over The Forums-Page directly verlinkt.

Greeting
Roland

Intel Duo E8400 3,0 GHz / 4 GB RAM / 1000 GB HDD - ATI Radeon HD 4770 512 MB - Windows 7 Home Premium 32Bit - XProfan X4

10/25/05 ▲

- Page 4 -

alike How - I find it beautiful the itself Roland here too To word reports.

i think - if it the community suspekt would - would it remote stay. means if I Roland would would I Perhaps too for the time being something distance aufs occur glances - but I be me sure, if I Roland would, would me the occur former or later fallen.

@Roland: Sorry that I here strain ebend in the 3.person from you speech. ;D

10/25/05 ▲

Frank
Abbing

Hi,

are You sure, that the from you looked Splashscreen in the XProfan-Help was???

quite sure.

here would I say, that so a list not The Help heard. The list heard sooner into Readme-File the XProfan-CD. The could in this Hinsicht something detail his, Perhaps even a Own Helpfile.

Lies-me-File would but already aale. hears itself sensible on.

naturally is it Geschmacksache, whether one The Klammeraffen übersichtlicher finds or not. These Discussion there were in a previous Forum already once and there tendierte a majority to that Klammeraffen. eshalb kept I tappt im dunkeln in manuals and Help.

sure, Geschmackssache. nevertheless is it one old hat and unnecessary. an Help ought to whom actually stood the items show - the Goto have you got indeed out taken, weils not any more Up-to-date is...
but is naturally your decision

10/25/05 ▲

Dietmar
Horn

Hi,

the leidige Topic Profan-Helpfile there in the RGH-Forum already since years always time again.

still unfortunately has bzgl. elementarer Syntaxfehler or. not eindeutiger Sprungmarken to date so well How nothing on it changed.

me personally is the meanwhile indifferently, because I already long enough thereby be (since Profan² 3.3) and me so abgefunden have, that a further Discussion over this issue eh nothing bring becomes (because it already since years nothing brought has).

still unfortunately erlebe I it in my Programmierkursen yet always almost daily, that it one Beginner yet always almost unmöglich is, on attempt z.B. with Strg + F1 The korrekte Hilfeseite to Syntax the Messagebox-Befehls nachzuschlagen. further such Examples in this Preislage are in the RGH-Forum number of times and repeatedly called been. Result: same zero (To including XProfan 9.0).

I can it really not any more understand, and so the Klammeraffe to so many years yet always dragged becomes. of my opinion to confused the a Beginner sooner, as that it it nützt. and who itself the to years so angewöhnt has (because it so necessary been was), the becomes this Monkeys in the Help probably hardly miss, because it The Zusammenhänge of former since knows. The CREATE-command get still z.B. too 1-2-fix of today on tommorrow without large Discussion umbenannt, and the has none big disturbed. against it watts over plenty sinnlosere Changes weeks- and monatelang discusses. i think there to that example on The damalige story with the GoTo-commands.

an list the gängigsten Tools for Profan or. XProfan would sure eachone Beginner helpful find. name the Tools - integrally short Description - Link - and well. Idealerweise naturally same everything on The each actually XProfan-CD with on it. Space for would still More as sufficient present - if need be Gibts then even on wish sometime a XProfan-DVD with everything thatswhy and Dran, what of XProfan-Author examined and würdig found watts. so much Kundenfreundlichkeit ought to one nowadys whom Käufern of his Produktes already angedeihen let, even if the initially with something erhöhtem Zeitaufwand joined would.

here in the Community is meanwhile of course too so quite everything to find, what the Profaner-marrow glücklicher hit can. still Why because these Page not too finally explizit in the Profan-Help allude?

because it to our XProfan-Community in this quality world-wide anyhow no Kongurrenz gives (not yet once the offizielle RGH-Support-Forum would I moreover count like), could itself therefore too nobody on the Schlips trod feel.

naturally can always argumentieren: then look still on [...]

to, and there find You any left. for kundenfreundlich stops I such a thing on any Cases not, because finally is XProfan yes a Kaufprodukt and not Freeware. Also having (too nationwide) yet long ago not any XProfan, The it itself wish, a superschnellen modernen computer with all Schikanen, with DSL-Connection and Flatrate and can not time so on The speedy regularly 10, 20 or yet More MB through your 56k-modem contuse. and that itself schoolboy time quick z.B. in the school several -zig MB download and on CD burn or on USB-Stick Save can, the might well not only here with us in saxons sooner The exception his.

many others User are there with safety another opinion. The Community is of my opinion after a freundlicher, offener place for people, The the same hobby joins. not any more, but neither less.
what You as expires betitelst, is in reality candidness and Meinungsfreiheit.
I yourself likes too no Beleidigungen, and there would I as Admin here einschreiten. but who itself the Public with its Werken position, ought to already review tolerate can.

Diesen Worten of Frank is really nothing more hinzuzufügen, except that I vorbehaltlos each this Sätze reinen conscience sign could, and eachone of my schoolboy sure ditto (anderenfalls would tappt im dunkeln not over ands over again here herkommen). this concerns particularly The candidness and Meinungsfreiheit.

whom XPRF-Debugger have I yourself yet ditto not yet sensible running get, what about me know too none of my Kursteilnehmer or other known, The the yet gepackt having. On Bugberichte on whom Author have I of beginning on aware waived, because already on my and others Notes in the RGH-Forum bzgl. the Profan-Helpfile in the past tense no reasonable reaction coming. I otherwise not straight someone be, the with (zugegeben sometimes probably whom jeweiligen Author too nervenden) Bugberichten by Mail not straight economical bypassing, the go here at least David, Frank and Rolf to Genüge confirm can. never went and goes it me thereby however therefore, the jeweilige Program schlechtzumachen, mieszureden, Besserwisser To play, or otherwise something on this primitiven Level. If then of Author thereupon a reaction erfolgte, led the further Mailkontakt (at least with whom three named Authors) yet without exception moreover, that the found Bugs by degrees ausgemerzt go could - sometimes already after a couple hours (my Paradebeispiel this is always iF with the komischen Nick

, the in the past tense often in the Stundentakt XPSE-UpDates uploaded having), mostly however with all others after a couple Meet or. to few weeks.

means if I Roland would would I Perhaps too for the time being something distance aufs occur glances - but I be me sure, if I Roland would, would me the occur former or later fallen.

the second Halbsatz can I vorbehaltlos consent, the first against it unfortunately not time with Bauchschmerzen.

an politics the ruhigen hand or. the first time Abwartens has yet never something Vernünftiges produced - weder in the actually large politics, still in the XProfan-politics. clear - there can itself everywhere too Perhaps occasionally time vergaloppieren, but this is m.E. still -zig time rather and anerkennenswerter, as constantly only abzuwarten and tatenlos from the background out zuzuschauen, How others people your Fäden to be nuts.

i remember there only on The fruchtlosen Diskussionen between the Time of XProfan 8 and XProfan 9 in the RGH-Forum bzgl. the several Commands in one line of code. what power there our small iFchen

simply still and heimlich in its Berliner Kämmerlein? it can The people in the RGH-Forum diskutieren and itself therefore almost The Köppe einschlagen. within shortest Time building it these (and others) Opportunities simply in its XPSE one and position The XProfan-world to completed lowdown. On these Nature and point ought to of my opinion to prospective too XProfan or. the XProfan-market rather functions.

who for itself yourself determining, that it defined Feautures in XProfan or XPSE not needed, the becomes still not moreover forced, these To benefit, or? still probably there not little XProfan, The already others Programmiersprachen ausgiebiger gotten to know had, before tappt im dunkeln to profane or. XProfan punched are (by me were the Assembler, C++, Turbo-Pascal and Delphi been). And if one then suddenly by the usage of XPSE with XProfan again half-way with the Syntax program can, How to the from the named Programmiersprachen over years away dwelt been was, then can the still no blemish for XProfan his, or? and Why then not at least EINE EINZIGE ZEILE in the Helpfile with z.B. the Info, that it something like How XPSE, XPIA, etc. at all gives?

of my opinion to border it already soon on The Mißachtung the unselfish Engagements the Authors for XProfan- Community, if such inspired Tools, How XPSE, XPIA, ProSpeed.dll, ListView.dll, The whole SK*.dll, Prf2Cpp etc. with keinem word in the official Helpfile erwähnt go. what would because so scornfully on it, if these (and ggf. others Profi-Tools, wozu I naturally absolutely too ROC count would like) there at least with a short Info and Downloadlink erwähnt would? Yes, Yes - I know yourself, that ROC on the XProfan-CD with on it is - but in the Help seek one a Info on ROC to this many years kontinuierlicher and uneigennütziger ROC-Entwicklungsarbeit against it yet always unfortunately in vain!

One further Topic would finally one vernünftiger Profan-editor!

yet could me yet none say or show, How one with a the both mitgelieferten Editoren its code half-way sensible and reliably with Tabs einrücken can. because these stinknormale and simple Editierfunktion weder with profed.exe yet with prfpad.exe works, back my Kursteilnehmer your Source as always with space one (or tappt im dunkeln benefit PrFellow, because so works the at least). particularly therefore use I as always whom editor of PrFellow. As I said, I mean so really only The reinen Editier-functions, and not the other more or less useful thatswhy-around. The PrFellow-editor zeigts on any Cases yet always all, How pure Editierfunktionen nowadys sensible To functions having!

to that Schluß yet something to the Community-regulate:

any regulate given, there and becomes it always give must, once itself several people to a joint do zusammenfinden. thereby is it beside the point, whether these community one state, a family, a Schulklasse, one Computerverein, one Biertrinkerverein, or one Karnickelverein is. If someone as Member of/ one such community with of/ one or several regulate not all right is, then ought to it these regulate kongret name, and it can above together and democratic discusses go. contact persons this is also available in ours Community enough and to spare people: who yourself with the iF

on none joint denominator come can, the contact itself even on a the others Admins. who with me as stupid-Hörnchen

here possible not zurecht comes, the contact itself even with seinem trouble on iF

, on Rolf, Screen memory, or on a the others Admins. but only simply To say: I am not ready, any regulate To to accept - the would heutezutage eachone half-way intelligente 12-jährige schoolboy reasonable into Rubrik primitivstes Biertisch-Diskussions-level sort can!.

Greeting
Dietmar

Multimedia für Jugendliche und junge Erwachsene - MMJ Hoyerswerda e.V. [...]

Windows 95 bis Windows 7
Profan² 6.6 bis XProfan X2 mit XPSE

Das große XProfan-Lehrbuch: [...]

RGH

Dietmar horn

If me someone in a friendly Mail on konkrete Error in the Help hinweist, so becomes the in the rule too korrigiert. If icvh with the filling the Mails, time a übersehe, so Please I circa excuse!

Dietmar horn

still unfortunately erlebe I it in my Programmierkursen yet always almost daily, that it one Beginner yet always almost unmöglich is, on attempt z.B. with Strg + F1 The korrekte Hilfeseite to Syntax the Messagebox-Befehls nachzuschlagen.

means if I with the Cursor over messagebox stand and Strg-F1 press, I get from the Help a selection the relevanten Topics offered, of them I me the suitable auswähle. To manchen Schlüsselwörtern there several item and the then displayed. the should so his.

Dietmar horn

I can it really not any more understand, and so the Klammeraffe to so many years yet always dragged becomes.

As I said: this is Geschmacksache. as it The necessity not any more given, it To use, there were these Discussion already once. and there was The majority the opinion, that its usage it deutlicher make, what a installed function in XProfan be and what not. and therefore respect I still hereon, it in Help and manuals To use, even if I it in my few XProfan-Programs hardly More do.
Tja, one can it now times not each right make. but this is now really a Kleinigkeit.

Dietmar horn

an list the gängigsten Tools for Profan or. XProfan would sure eachone Beginner helpful find.

How I already Frank answered: in the Helpfile self see I this Space not, but on the CD power a such list sure sense. i'll to package the next CD once more moreover Call, me The Information zukommen let. Kene fear: without express WEunsch and permit becomes nobody called!

Dietmar horn

Idealerweise naturally same everything on The each actually XProfan-CD with on it.

naturally! the have I bislang jedesmal so made. Look you The CD still at times! each time yet have I therefore gebeten me The things (or. The Downloadlinks) zukommen To let, The with on it should!

Dietmar horn

whom XPRF-Debugger have I yourself yet ditto not yet sensible running get, what about me know too none of my Kursteilnehmer or other known, The the yet gepackt having.

The Version, The on the XProfan 9 CD with on it is, functions by me free from problems. I have tappt im dunkeln under How to remove and windows 2000 tested.

Dietmar horn

Dietmar horn

means if I Roland would would I Perhaps too for the time being something distance aufs occur glances - but I be me sure, if I Roland would, would me the occur former or later fallen.

the second Halbsatz can I vorbehaltlos consent, the first against it unfortunately not time with Bauchschmerzen.

where since the procession The distance sooner zwangsweise was and yet is. well, The dwelling is arranged, the leg is again OK, but: yet always is my Entwicklungsrechner without Monitor, there this now since 9 weeks with GERICOM in Reperatur and that the me no Austauschgerät send. so remaining me presently only my - for XProfan-development ungeeignetes - Notebook for Internetzugang and the computer in the firm. (Letzteren can I,may I naturally only very, very economical for sooner private Internetausflüge benefit ... if the boss not in the sew is.)

Dietmar horn

of my opinion to border it already soon on The Mißachtung the unselfish Engagements the Authors for XProfan- Community, if such inspired Tools, How XPSE, XPIA, ProSpeed.dll, ListView.dll, The whole SK*.dll, Prf2Cpp etc. with keinem word in the official Helpfile erwähnt go.

of my Erachtens heard such a thing not The offizielle Hilfefdatei to XProfan-Syntax. but all these Tools find itself on the CD and the ROC is siogar into Development Environment by Menu eingebunden. That a Erwähnung this Tools in a own Helpfile to CD meaningfully would, I had in a response moreover supra already erwähnt.

Dietmar horn

One further Topic would finally one vernünftiger Profan-editor!

with Version 7.5 I had Yes already hereon hingewiesen, that I the Profan-editor not any more moreover entwickle, separate only yet on The each new XProfan-Syntax anpasse. this is the fact geschuldet, that I XProfan in the One-Personen-Nebenerwerb entwickle and me next to Fulltime-job and family only limited temporal Ressourcen available stand.
i'm though gladly ready others Editoren mitzuliefern, The me moreover offered go. Bislang was is only the PrfPad.
myself use to XProfan-Programming schwerpunktmäßig whom already the öfteren erwähnten Freeware-editor CONTEXT, the itself well on XProfan adjust can and then too one good Syntax-Highlighting bid. on the market there a whole row of inspired Programmiereditoren, which on each arbitrary Language adjust let.
I must though confess, that me The letztlich in the Forum mentioned Scintilla-DLL and The then mitgelieferte rudimentäre Version one XProfan-Editors moreover animiert has, in reinem XProfan self a editor with Tabbed-Editing, Syntax Highlighting, proposition,anagement etc. To write. The is presently of course already so far gediehen, that I in Hauptberuf so free from problems several projects in XProfan entwickle, but mach my savour not yet far enough, circa so on The XProfan-Public To zurück.

Greeting
Roland

Intel Duo E8400 3,0 GHz / 4 GB RAM / 1000 GB HDD - ATI Radeon HD 4770 512 MB - Windows 7 Home Premium 32Bit - XProfan X4

RGH

Frank Abbing

Hi,

Frank Abbing

are You sure, that the from you looked Splashscreen in the XProfan-Help was???

quite sure.

I fürchte, Dur redest not from the XProfan-Help, separate a Betaversion of Stefans Help-Tool The XProfan-Help (profanhlp.exe). there there were kurzzeitig time a Variante with Splashscreen. The was but never on of/ one XProfan-CD with on it.

Greeting
Roland

Intel Duo E8400 3,0 GHz / 4 GB RAM / 1000 GB HDD - ATI Radeon HD 4770 512 MB - Windows 7 Home Premium 32Bit - XProfan X4

Matthias
Arlt

with interest verfolge I these Discussion over a new
Profan-IDE. yet only lesend, I self not so the trouble
so having and I. PRFellow reicht me mostly from and seek hold
yet always Seinesgleichen, even if it in Teilbereichen already very
good Alternativen gives. How z.B. ROKOs Objekrcreator, circa only a
To name. too have I yet long ago not everything available ausprobiert.

What the review on Help concerns, so can I these only conditioned
understand. to that a is me quite alike, whether there now z.B. the
Klammeraffe erwähnt becomes or not. especially since Yes hereon hingewiesen becomes,
that which usage of course possible but not necessary is. who
it use wants, should it means do or it even give up.
to that others must Overview Another founts not absolutely part
Help his. Dahinein belong all The items, The coercive and
unveränderlich to profane belong, means lasting currently are.
Web-Adressen etc. are however oftmals right veränderlicher nature and
should (with corresponding Info) in a gesonderten Overview
come along, How through Roland suggested.

furthermore falls me on, that increasing The terms Profan and
XProfan, mitunter into and the same set, confusion gewürfelt
go, without that clear discernible is (first right not for Neulinge),
whether so now Profan as Programming-Language on itself or z.B. XProfan
in the special (means versionsbezogen ex Version 8 about) meant is.
sure is it, particularly for diejenigen, The first since XProfan thereby
are, not always simply einzuschätzen, whether these or those Possibility
already into Vorversionen present was. nevertheless should we circa
a tidy Begriffstrennung ready his.

so diving first recent at private talk shop The question on,
whether about XPSE or XPIA coercive XProfan assume or with Vorversionen useable are. The question letting not clarify, there one eindeutiger Info not attempt found go could...
very this wants one but know, before(!) one itself something herunterlädt.
Dankenswerterweise watts already hereon hingewiesen, that not eachone always and everywhere a speedy and kostengünstigen Netzzugang has !

so, now but first enough the (hopefully konstruktiven, in each drop
but wohlmeinenden) review. ultimately should no novel from it go.

Greeting Matthias

p.s. The Postings wären incidentally very much better readable, if the
mittlere Frame the Page breiter would. Perhaps liesse itself there what
release. really wären linker and right Frame only on the
Startseite necessary. it would too whom Seitenaufbau ungemein speed...

WinXP SP2, Win7 - XProfan 10/11/FreeProfan32 - Xpia

Matthias
Arlt

another kurzer Nachtrag to that Klammeraffen and vergleichbaren Things:

would be the monkey in this context not erwähnt and a uneingeweihter
User bekäme a older, with Klammeraffen durchsetzten, Source in
The Hand; immediate would The then very entitled review loudly go,
and so is because The Help moreover ausschweigt.

A good software and its Help draw not lastly therefore
from, that (so far possible and tenable) on a Abwärtskompatibilität
geachtet becomes.

Greeting Matthias

WinXP SP2, Win7 - XProfan 10/11/FreeProfan32 - Xpia

Frank
Abbing

Hi,

so diving first recent at private talk shop The question on,
whether about XPSE or XPIA coercive XProfan assume or with Vorversionen useable are.

XPIA power too with versions to XProfan sense. once generiert it Yes a new Profancode, into a Assembler-Dll eingebettet is. this code can only with XProfan used go, because it The extensions To Long first since Profan 8 gives.
to that second becomes but a Assembler-Dll and the moreover gehörige Inc, or. Ph File created. These Dll can ex Profan 5 used and be in its programs be installed.

The XPSE functions - faith I - too ex Profan 5.

@Matthias:

The Postingbreite is me too one thorn in the eye - there falls me already something one... The speed the Seitenaufbaus is of this however not tributary.

on the Downloadseite the XPSE standing: [box:19bd2fcc4b]with the XProfan-Syntax-Enhancer statten tappt im dunkeln your XProfan with additional command, and of/ one advanced Syntax from. XPSE supported never ältere versions of XProfan separate orientiert itself always on the latest Release. XPSE becomes always free his.[/box:19bd2fcc4b]
salvo.

Frank
Abbing

with the XProfan-Syntax-Enhancer statten tappt im dunkeln your XProfan with additional command, and of/ one advanced Syntax from. XPSE supported never ältere versions of XProfan separate orientiert itself always on the latest Release. XPSE becomes always free his.

the concerns only The special extensions. Normaler Profancode or XPIA-code becomes naturally processing.
XPIA uses XPSE momentarily only as Precompiler, circa Inc-Files etc. in a Code link

Matthias
Arlt

@IF

...Downloadseite XPSE:
thanks, I geb the then so moreover. I had beforehand only zitiert, what on me herangetragen watts... Perhaps has derjenige only into Forums red and is then not at all To to Downloadseite vorgedrungen !?
Möglicherweise behave it Yes itself at XPIA similar.

@F.Abbing
our Answer had itself timewise überschnitten. too in this drop counts
naturally the previous properly !

...Seitendarstellung:
would be beautiful, if you there what make could: thanks beforehand !

Greeting Matthias

WinXP SP2, Win7 - XProfan 10/11/FreeProfan32 - Xpia